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Provability and Transhumanism Options
jdlaw
Posted: Sunday, May 23, 2021 5:55:08 AM

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Another great video by Veritasium

I Can Prove It

My exact thought from the title of the video before even watching it was that nothing is provable. I guess I had that bias going in, but since I already subscribe this YouTube channel I knew it was going to be pretty good. 

I watched the whole thing anyway.  The video does explain "incompleteness" Paradox (which is similar to Trilemma) eventually.  It was a 30 minute video.

It is also fascinating (to me) that Munchausen Trilema (infinite regression) and Munchausen Syndrome (factitious disorder or psychosis of needing health care when not sick) are both named after the same "Hieronymus Karl Friedrich, Freiherr von Münchhausen" who was a real survivor of the Russuan-Turkish war who after the war became known for his tall tales about his own conquests during the war.  Munchausen  later became a sort of 18th Century "Chuck Norris" because the satirists of the time would use Baron Munchausen as a character for telling unbelievable stories (like how Baron Munchausen was so strong that he pulled himself out of quicksand by his own hair). 

It all returns us to the simple and fundamental nature of reality (even when it comes to mathematics) that there is an inexplicable (ineffible) state of first person human experience that defies all objective truth. The simple act of observation  (observing something) is never complete, but remains always a construct of the mind only and made possible by the way we think.

Which makes this all a perfect video in Transhumanist discussion circles.  "Now, for this cause I know that man is nothing, which thing I never had supposed." Moses 1:10 Pearl of Great Price (or for the secularists out there "Onions have layers" quote from Shrek).
"Bot"-tee-licious
Posted: Tuesday, May 25, 2021 6:05:36 AM
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jdlaw wrote:
Another great video by Veritasium

I Can Prove It

Yep, it is, jdlaw. The content, the animations and everything else about it are superb. A second viewing is a must to really absorb its contents. Russell's Paradox, Gödel's Incompleteness Theorem, and Turing's Halting problem all in the one video, what more can one want (or maybe, not want, if it leaves you more confused than ever!).

Something for us to bear in mind is William Shakespeare's quote about wisdom from 'As You Like It': "The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool." No matter how much you know, it is nothing compared to everything that there is yet to know.

And, this one, by Confucius, which really hits home for me: "By three methods we may learn wisdom. First by reflection, which is the noblest. Second, by imitation, which is easiest, and third by experience, which is the bitterest."

jdlaw wrote:
My exact thought from the title of the video before even watching it was that nothing is provable.

I suppose if nothing is provable then one can't go wrong by taking the Taoist/Buddhist 'Middle Way' approach to life. It shows us the paradox of the Universe, within and beyond the opposites. Neither a path of denial nor of affirmation. A way to peace and liberation in this very life.

"Bot"-tee-licious
Posted: Tuesday, May 25, 2021 8:23:56 AM
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Oops, Edit.

Sorry jdlaw, on reading it seemed that I was directing my words to you personally but I meant them to encompass everyone, hence I've now inserted the words 'for us' in the first line of the second paragraph, and substituted 'one' for 'you' in the first line of the last paragraph. I really should read over the content carefully before posting!

jim
Posted: Saturday, June 19, 2021 1:07:37 PM

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Great video - thanks for sharing, jdlaw.

A few random observations...

1. My brain hurts and I need to watch it again
2. He narrates this from my favorite hiking trail, which isn't far from where I live
3. Unknowable things makes intuitive sense in the "physical" world (dynamic reality generation). In the mathematical world, they are almost more interesting. Not sure if there is anything fundamental about it though, rather than it being due to forced inconsistencies.
4. The gapless quantum system bothers me. I feel like even the so-called continuous energy band is really just a finite set of energy levels; the gap between which is just way smaller than a gapped system.
"Bot"-tee-licious
Posted: Sunday, June 20, 2021 4:15:43 AM
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jim wrote:
4. The gapless quantum system bothers me. I feel like even the so-called continuous energy band is really just a finite set of energy levels; the gap between which is just way smaller than a gapped system.

So are analog and continuous concepts in maths such as continuous functions and spaces, real and complex numbers, only useful inventions of the human mind, to solve problems in a discrete world with approximations? Are continuous concepts ontologically real or not? Is the Universe computable? Still, the controversy lives on!

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